Perché c'è troppo odio per l'Alfa Romeo?

[sanji99]

I was looking forward to buying a new car, I was between Alfa Giulietta, Classe A, Serie 1 and A3

As usual, I've done a research and, in summary, everyone agrees that the Alfa is garbage. I can't understand what.

I took the driving tests for all three cars and found the Alfa the most engaging and fun. Some say the Alfa's interior is shit, and well, compared to the Mercedes it is a bit, since the MBUX and the tech are great. But compared to the other Germans I did not perceive a notable difference, perhaps only in the infotainment, which for me is not a big problem. But the seats, group and everything were great in the Alfa, it felt premium with carbon fiber and soft plastics.

And on the outside, for me, the Alfa is much more beautiful than the Germans.

Maybe I'm self ignorant. Very possible. But I am in love with my Juliet.

What do you think?

 

[syrsylvain]

Hi, I think you will mostly receive here in this forum confirmation the cars are not that bad. I drove several bmws before, got my stelvio quadrifoglio now, what you said is in essence correct. Good cars, definitely lacking quality on certain aspects, but so much more interesting on others. You need to make compromises with this type of car. Maybe with the Germans, you can avoid doing them, but with extra cash. Is the cash you put on Germans to get overall a better quality? that's a different question. I never read posts in English here before, I don’t know if that means/justifies you will get few answers. I am a very happy driver of my current QF, and so my sons are. Even my wife is getting used to it. She was ok my x5 but hated my 435 m.

 

[ziopalm]

bcause people are ignorant

 

[VURT]

Perché c’è troppa ignoranza!

 

[zagatolino]

Welcome.

Regarding your question, I see the following points here in Germany.

1. most people talk badly about Alfa Romeo without ever having driven an Alfa. Some of them even talk about the susceptibility to rust, although this is no longer an issue with AR. This time with the rust (70s and 80s) is still in the heads.

2. in German car magazines, Alfa Romeo is very often rated badly in order to let the German cars win. When I see that the weighting of an infotainment counts more than the driving dynamics, then this has nothing to do with driving a car anymore. This is my personal opinion.

3. what I also see is that people with a VW, BMW, MB keep up with regular maintenance. Some Alfa owners only do something when something lights up or breaks. Accordingly, it looks like the Alfa is more vulnerable.

I also have a Giulietta and white,
that the quality of the interior is not as good as that of an A3.
But with the Stelvio and the Giulia, Alfa Romeo has caught up with the German premium car manufacturers in terms of quality.
I recommend you watch this video. Just look at Harry's grin while driving the Giulietta.

Best wishes

......................................................



Per quanto riguarda la tua domanda, vedo i seguenti punti qui in Germania.

1) La maggior parte della gente parla male dell'Alfa Romeo senza averne mai guidata una. Alcuni di loro parlano anche della suscettibilità alla ruggine, anche se questo non è più un problema con l'AR. Questi tempi con la ruggine (anni 70 e 80) è ancora nelle loro teste.

2. nelle riviste di auto tedesche l'Alfa Romeo è molto spesso valutata male per far vincere le auto tedesche. Quando vedo che la valutazione di un infotainment conta più che la dinamica di guida, allora questo non ha più niente da fare con la guida di un'auto. Questa è la mia opinione personale.

3. quello che vedo anche è che le persone con una VW, BMW, MB si tengono al passo con la manutenzione regolare. Alcuni proprietari di Alfa fanno qualcosa solo quando qualcosa si accende o si rompe. Di conseguenza, sembra che Alfa sia più suscettibile.

Ho anche una Giulietta e lo so,
che la qualità degli interni non è buona come quella di una A3.
Ma con lo Stelvio e la Giulia, Alfa Romeo ha raggiunto i produttori tedeschi di auto premium in termini di qualità.
Vi consiglio di guardare questo video. Basta guardare il sorriso di Harry mentre guida la Giulietta.

 

[gigivicenza]

A livello meccanico le italiane erano i a spanna sopra come affidabilità e prestazioni alle tedesche… ora hanno copiato di sana pianta dai tedeschi assemblaggi interni e resto peggiorando di molto meccanica di motore ecc.. per me era meglio prima. Non è possibile mettere componenti incastrati che per fare un tagliando ci vuole una giornata rischiando che le plastica varia ti rimane in mano…

 

[Lucky64]

Purtroppo molti, non tutti, che acquistano auto italiane, lo fanno perché gli serve un mezzo per spostarsi, non curano la manutenzione e al momento dell'acquisto dell'auto guardano il prezzo e ascoltano il parere di parenti e amici. E spesso non si prendono cura della macchina. Inoltre la vendita è il post vendita non è curato dalle concessionarie. Molti operatori appaiono svogliati quando si entra nella sala vendita, non gradiscono acquirenti preparati che non si prestano a comprare quello che vogliono loro, e in officina ti accolgono con sufficienza. Mi dispiace dire che quando ho acquistato I'auto mi sembrava più che volessero vendermi una finanziaria che un'auto. Inoltre i clienti di auto molto spesso non sono documentati sulle qualità dinamiche delle auto come la Stelvio. Pertanto se il venditore si limita ad un freddo preventivo senza invogliarti ad acquistare compri altrove. A me, e a mio fratello, è successo questo: se avessimo dato retta all'accoglienza dei venditori A.R. staremo guidando una BMW od altro anziché la Stelvio.

 

[mcrs969]

interesting talk... I honestly thought rage against Alfa was an italian phenomenon, I am of the impression that outside Italy people look at Alfa like: "rare, not robust, nice cars". Is this general impression confirmed or do you see different opinions? By the way... where are you from @syrsylvain @sanji99 ?

However to explain myself why, I've extremely simplified the situation in different type of causes:
1) Alfa Romeo products are wonderful to drive, some lacking in quality is however evident and clear when it comes to a comparison with another brand (most likely german)
2) Alfa Romeo products are supported by a underperforming post sales, the circulation of information among the repair shops is reduced with respect to other brands, often when you have a simple problem with an Alfa Romeo you may fix it immediately or you may end up in a loop, it just depends if the service partner is aware of the proper solution / root cause or if they're with no clue at all, in the past this phenomenon used to have root cause in product design "silos made" while now it seems to deal with complexity of electronic and some process of development given to third party companies (like progressive reduction of CRF - Centro Ricerche Fiat and increase of outsourced R&D, Alfa Giulia/Stelvio were limited time projects with involvment of several outsourced companies and resources from Ferrari and Maserati who now are back at their original companies or even in German market for better continuity and company industrial plans which are solid and consistent...)
3) Currently, if you buy an Alfa, you are one little dot of "red" in a blue/grey/black dot populated market, the blue/grey/black are the main brands from Germany, so you drive around with your beautiful design car and you are often noted in a negative way for easy vulnerable facts like:
- you're still running with xenon or halogen headlights while I do have led or laser...
- your infotaiment is called "connect", does not even provide WiFi hotspot, my 2016 skoda has wifi hotspot and it is a skoda....
- some quality issue is present in a considerable amount of units, we're far away from the 6 standard deviations excellence, we're maybe at 1 sigma with lots of DOA parts and vague retrofit policies...
- your car suspension (proper ones, not made of cheap design and material like mine) are often showing some extreme compromise like possible tyres jump at small manouvering speed or suspension squeaks when your car is a bit older and got some winter on her/its shoulders (like 147, 156...)

and the above facts, are TRUE! they are true and, combining all of them together, adding up the fact that the company corporate support is limited and often slow, makes Alfa look like a dangerous choice, but still, breathtaking when you drive an Alfa and breathtaking when you see a clean and nice maintained Alfa driving around, doesn't matter if it is an old 145 or if it is a Giulia GTAm, all cars in between, and older ones too, are always capturing people's attention, and when the car is not released yet, the press rushes at publishing something...!

then, the final fact, if you have a nice house and you worked hard to get it, I am feeling some sort of envy, which is healthy envy for your nice achievement and I can't really hate you, your house or your work for that... there's too few elements and there's too much to compare... however when I have a Golf, which is an extremely good car, moderated and performing average -good in all aspects, I can for sure look at somebody's Alfa with some sort of feeling because the same car costs a bit less, generates much more engagement (love and hate also sometimes... ) and of course it is just beautiful to see and wonderful to drive...! so yes, when I'm driving my Golf I'm satisfied, but nobody loves "average stuff", we need to suffer and feel hard to be happy, so why not attacking the Alfa Owner for clear and obvious defects of his car, with the target to generate some hard fealing as my Golf is not giving me anything... I need to look hard feelings somewhere else and as I want to be coherent I can't love an Alfa, then I must hate it... I mean.. why Alfa people are always so in love or so in hate with their cars while I'm just using my Golf and looking for some emotion but the best comes from the nice gestures of the infotaiment?!

NOTE: when I wrote "my Golf" I'm just making the hypothesis, currently I own 2 Alfa and one 1996 Citroen

 

[ziopalm]

so yes, when I'm driving my Golf I'm satisfied, but nobody loves "average stuff", we need to suffer and feel hard to be happy, so why not attacking the Alfa Owner for clear and obvious defects of his car, with the target to generate some hard fealing as my Golf is not giving me anything... I need to look hard feelings somewhere else and as I want to be coherent I can't love an Alfa, then I must hate it...

dici che il vaggaro fa come la volpe e l'uva?

 

[mcrs969]

dici che il vaggaro fa come la volpe e l'uva?

più o meno... mi spiego meglio,
non è detto che chi prende una serie 3 o una Golf non possa comprarsi un'Alfa e quindi la denigri per questo... piuttosto mi immagino che non scelgano un'Alfa e poi, visto quanto quasi tutti i proprietari di Alfa cadano sotto una sorta di incantesimo e visto come la stampa corre a pubblicare articoli/video/foto di un'Alfa i vari proprietari di veicoli "grigi" inizino a provare una sorta di invidia fastidio..

c'è anche un altro aspetto, molti di noi sono poco obiettivi, poco aperti e diversi proprietari di Alfa tendono a considerarsi il meglio assoluto su tutti gli indicatori... questo mette in circolo una sorta di fanatismo che non piace, a mio avviso la passione non deve colonizzare il cervello offuscando la capacità di giudizio.. e questo forse è un fenomeno più da social network che da forum clubalfa dove devo dire che i confronti sono sempre ben calibrati (salvo alcune eccezioni che però ci piacciono così )

english (maccheroni english)
ziopalm asked me if I think it is kind of "the fox and the grape" with other car owners vs Alfa Romeo.
I replied that I believe it is partially like that, it is not said that they can't afford an Alfa or that they are in the situation where an Alfa is not reachable... I rather think that they are not choosing an Alfa and then they notice how the majority of Alfa owners literally fall in love with their cars, still the "other car owners" look with some sort of envyj how the press and the people react to Alfa, definitively different than other makers... This would make "other car owners" feel something bad/against Alfa...

and then there's another aspect, which I forgot in my previous reply, I believe some Alfa owner is not really "unbiased", some of the owners of Alfa are acting like they're owning the best absolute car in the world, on all possible aspects... this spreads around some kind of fanaticism which I honestly don't like and I disagree with, I believe the passion shall not intoxicate the brain affecting the objectiveness... this maybe is more a "social netwrok" issue than a "clubalfa" problem, I have always found quite balanced opinions and pleasant exchanges on this forum (a part for some exception which we love like it is ... )